Re: Lest We Forget - Era Darurat 1948-1960, 1968-1989 & Ancaman Komunis Pasca 1989

by MMW Thu 04 Aug 2011, 3:39 pm

mumuchi wrote:yes MMW...but the fact is CPM does not practise marxist communism only. see hilited above.

Tak susah Muchi. Sama je ideologi tu. Mari aku rungkaikan ideology CPM yang engkau tulis dengan apa yang aku tulis ye... ada persamaan atau tidak:-

mumuchi wrote:
CPM’s efforts at mass persuasion in Malaya, was attempted via the Maoist methodology of ‘thought determines action’, which in turn depended upon the constant reiteration and reinforcement of the five following messages: first, the CPM was a party of the masses both locally and globally;

I said a) 1 Parti politik - Communist Party /Central government

mumuchi wrote: Second, the masses were being oppressed and neglected by the Singapore and Malaysian governments in favour of the capitalist elites and foreign powers;

I said communist theory generally states that the only way to solve the problems existing within capitalism (such as corruption) is for the working class who collectively constitute the main producer of wealth in society, and who are perpetually exploited and marginalised by the capitalist class, to overthrow the capitalist system. (CPM ubah perkataan aje makna sama)

mumuchi wrote: third, the practice of Marxism-Leninism-Maoism under the leadership of the CPM was the only way for the masses;

I said Communist theory generally states that the only way to solve the problems existing within capitalism (such as corruption) is for the working class.....

mumuchi wrote: fourth, the people of a small country can defeat aggression by a big country; and finally a call for the masses to unite under the CPM against their oppressors.

I said same as above united under CPM !

by mumuchi Thu 04 Aug 2011, 3:45 pm

tacang utk MMW..again saya tanya..ada sumtin that reminds you of sumtin more recent What a Face

by escortburuk Thu 04 Aug 2011, 3:47 pm

tin wrote:
mumuchi wrote:tula pasal..to define communism under CPM, kena buka course 10 credit hours tu jangan marah aa MMW

hahaha... tak payah.

wa dulu blajor dah 12 kredit hours dah. dah pening dah.

ingat lg prof wa bukak kelas dgn kenyataan "with the exception of communist ideology did not accept the existance of god, communism is, in principle, in line with Islamic principles...

amacam, bergoncang tak donia?

Ni quote dari Prof. Rashid Moten (pak sedara Tin hahaha) ke? Mcm pernah dgr je ayat2 tuh huhuhu

by MMW Thu 04 Aug 2011, 3:49 pm

tin wrote:
mumuchi wrote:tula pasal..to define communism under CPM, kena buka course 10 credit hours tu jangan marah aa MMW

hahaha... tak payah.

wa dulu blajor dah 12 kredit hours dah. dah pening dah.

ingat lg prof wa bukak kelas dgn kenyataan "with the exception of communist ideology did not accept the existance of god, communism is, in principle, in line with Islamic principles...

amacam, bergoncang tak donia?

Well actually Tin.... It's part true!Part true because Islam allowed to own personnel property (unlike Communist) that's why ada transaction, offer and acceptance ijab and qabul.

However the concept of people in Communist nearly the same as the concept of people in Islam. Sorry to say le in Islam tak ada konsep Sultan/Raja. Yang ada Khalifah.

Dan khalifah ini bertanggungjawab sepenuhnya kepada Rakyat (people). Dan dia tidak immune kepada undang-undang. Dan jawatan itu dipilih oleh rakyat bukan hereditary.

Ada konsep undi dalam bentuk Bai'ah. Komunis konsep ini tak ada. Dan dalam Islam tak kisah berapa banyak parti politik yang ada tetapi parti tersebut hendaklah menjadikan Al-Quran sebagai perlembagaannya.

So nak kata 1 parti? Mungkin betul dari segi fahaman/ideologi iaitu ISLAM!!

by anya8797 Thu 04 Aug 2011, 5:56 pm

MMW wrote:
mumuchi wrote:er aku rasa baik ko mintak penerangan ideologi komunisme PKM..different from regular komunisme..boleh explain MMW?

Actually sama je prinsip dia. Penjenamaan banyak tapi ideologi tu tetap sama.

Macam mazhab Syiah dan Ahli Sunnah Wal Jamaah le.

Prinsip komunis ialah:-

a) 1 Parti politik - Communist Party /Central government

b) Property belong to the people. No personnel ownership, even land. Harta dipanggil common ownership. People/Kerajaan hanya bagi kebenaran/lesen untuk menghuni atau berniaga sahaja. Boleh diambil bila-bila masa tanpa pampasan.

c) Production belong to the people/central government. Give to the people first before you can claim your part.

d) Centralised economy - everything being planned by the central government.

Communist theory generally states that the only way to solve the problems existing within capitalism (such as corruption) is for the working class who collectively constitute the main producer of wealth in society, and who are perpetually exploited and marginalised by the capitalist class, to overthrow the capitalist system.

In short Communist is a classless and stateless society structured upon common ownership of the means of production, free access to articles of consumption, and the end of wage labour and private property in the means of production and real estate.

hi M... i always find myself in awe of your extensive knowledge...

ada satu buku tajuk dia animal farm... written by george orwell... anya suka baca buku tuh sebab sekarang jarang ada penulis yang menulis double layered story macam tu lagi.....it's a children story but wriiten to describe the flaws of communism..... very interesting as it seeks to explain the concept and the flaws of the concept in the simplest language and language tool possible....the usage of analogies...
bila anya baca anya realise that.... while it is true that it is about equality yes.... but there will always..... always be that..... there are those who are more 'equal' than the others.... and when this happens in a nation that is highly regimented with blind obedience.... the result is even more devastating.....

by mumuchi Thu 04 Aug 2011, 8:14 pm

the pigs hate you ekekekeke!

by anya8797 Thu 04 Aug 2011, 11:02 pm

on the contrary....
the pigs played their role well dont you think?....favourite anya squealer....

by mumuchi Thu 04 Aug 2011, 11:05 pm

er nak oit ke tidak ni lol!

but seriously dah lama dah abca..can't really remember any details other than the pigs...tak silap tu fasal yanks call police pigs..

by anya8797 Thu 04 Aug 2011, 11:06 pm

mumuchi wrote:er nak oit ke tidak ni

jangan dulu.... Sad

by mumuchi Thu 04 Aug 2011, 11:07 pm

c edited version Very Happy

by observateur Fri 05 Aug 2011, 9:53 am

MMW wrote:
tin wrote:
mumuchi wrote:tula pasal..to define communism under CPM, kena buka course 10 credit hours tu jangan marah aa MMW

hahaha... tak payah.

wa dulu blajor dah 12 kredit hours dah. dah pening dah.

ingat lg prof wa bukak kelas dgn kenyataan "with the exception of communist ideology did not accept the existance of god, communism is, in principle, in line with Islamic principles...

amacam, bergoncang tak donia?

Well actually Tin.... It's part true!Part true because Islam allowed to own personnel property (unlike Communist) that's why ada transaction, offer and acceptance ijab and qabul.

However the concept of people in Communist nearly the same as the concept of people in Islam. Sorry to say le in Islam tak ada konsep Sultan/Raja. Yang ada Khalifah.

Dan khalifah ini bertanggungjawab sepenuhnya kepada Rakyat (people). Dan dia tidak immune kepada undang-undang. Dan jawatan itu dipilih oleh rakyat bukan hereditary.

Ada konsep undi dalam bentuk Bai'ah. Komunis konsep ini tak ada. Dan dalam Islam tak kisah berapa banyak parti politik yang ada tetapi parti tersebut hendaklah menjadikan Al-Quran sebagai perlembagaannya.

So nak kata 1 parti? Mungkin betul dari segi fahaman/ideologi iaitu ISLAM!!

just adding my 2 sen.

While it is true Islam permits asset ownership and enshrines the safeguarding of rights (rights to own for ex), Islam also encourages sacrificing or forgoing those rights (di dunia utk tebus akhirat).

Bila kurang memilikki, kurang rasa "tuan" dan lebih rasa hamba.

Note: Rights are not to be confused with honour. Maruah kena jaga seboleh2nya walaupun nyawa tebusannya.

by anya8797 Fri 05 Aug 2011, 9:58 am

mumuchi wrote:er nak oit ke tidak ni but seriously dah lama dah abca..can't really remember any details other than the pigs...tak silap tu fasal yanks call police pigs..

there are three pigs in the story... napoleon, snowball and squealer.... napoleon is of course the depiction of stalin.... squealer brings to mind pravda... representing propaganda.....

by MMW Fri 05 Aug 2011, 10:06 am

anya8797 wrote:

hi M... i always find myself in awe of your extensive knowledge...

ada satu buku tajuk dia animal farm... written by george orwell... anya suka baca buku tuh sebab sekarang jarang ada penulis yang menulis double layered story macam tu lagi.....it's a children story but wriiten to describe the flaws of communism..... very interesting as it seeks to explain the concept and the flaws of the concept in the simplest language and language tool possible....the usage of analogies...
bila anya baca anya realise that.... while it is true that it is about equality yes.... but there will always..... always be that..... there are those who are more 'equal' than the others.... and when this happens in a nation that is highly regimented with blind obedience.... the result is even more devastating.....

Bukan apa anya, M belajar Jurisprudence masa kat UIA dulu. Jadi ideologi komunis tu kita orang belajar jugak. Tin pun gitu.

Baca dan komen buku falsafah yang ditulis oleh Karl Max (Communist), Bentham, Austin prinsip Pluralism, Right dan sebagainya.

Buku Animal farm by George Orwell..... I heard about that book. Tapi M tak baca lagi.

But what you said is true.... Communist theory cantik but impractical. Tengok Hermit Kingdom - North Korea aje le. Kim Jong Il lives lavishly but the people starved!!!

What you said " there are those who are more 'equal' than the others.... and when this happens in a nation that is highly regimented with blind obedience.... the result is even more devastating...." can be seen in North Korea.

by MMW Fri 05 Aug 2011, 10:09 am

anya8797 wrote:
mumuchi wrote:er nak oit ke tidak ni but seriously dah lama dah abca..can't really remember any details other than the pigs...tak silap tu fasal yanks call police pigs..

there are three pigs in the story... napoleon, snowball and squealer.... napoleon is of course the depiction of stalin.... squealer brings to mind pravda... representing propaganda.....

I never heard this story before.... ceciter...ceciter.... What a Face

by powerw00t Fri 05 Aug 2011, 10:15 am

Cadang tukar tajuk atau buat penambahan sikit supaya tak derailed sangat dari... mochi?

by MMW Fri 05 Aug 2011, 10:20 am

powerw00t wrote:Cadang tukar tajuk atau buat penambahan sikit supaya tak derailed sangat dari... mochi?

Ok kot power..... sebab kita menceritakan perjuangan menentang komunis dan ideologi komunis.

by bijan Fri 05 Aug 2011, 10:22 am

Rasa thread ni dah ok .. byk benda yang aku tak tau... clarified sikit sebab banyak benda yg boleh digunakan...

by mumuchi Fri 05 Aug 2011, 11:54 am

to be frank that is why i chose the title..so macam MMW cakap as long as related why not?

by anya8797 Fri 05 Aug 2011, 11:09 pm

MMW wrote:
anya8797 wrote:
mumuchi wrote:er nak oit ke tidak ni but seriously dah lama dah abca..can't really remember any details other than the pigs...tak silap tu fasal yanks call police pigs..

there are three pigs in the story... napoleon, snowball and squealer.... napoleon is of course the depiction of stalin.... squealer brings to mind pravda... representing propaganda.....

I never heard this story before.... ceciter...ceciter....

hi M...
animal farm nih is actually a satirical story serves as a mockery to russian communism.....back then thinkers used storytelling as means of delivering their personal views albeit controversial ones...(another popular example would be "gulliver's travel" that portray the shortcomings of the 18th century english society)... the synopsis of the story is something like this:

"Animal Farm" tells the simple and tragic story of what happens when the oppressed farm animals rebel, drive out Mr. Jones, the farmer, and attempt to rule the farm themselves, on an equal basis. What the animals seem to have aimed at was a utopian sort of communism, where each would work according to his capacity, respecting the needs of others. The venture failed, and "Animal Farm" ended up being a dictatorship of pigs, who were the brightest, and most idle of the animals."

in short..what begun as an ideal optimism of what an utopian society should be....turn simple comrades into ruthless dictators who fully utilise propaganda as brainwashing mechanism... so that lies such as ...all animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than the others...(as squealer eloquently put) are not only overlooked but collectively embraced...

by anya8797 Fri 05 Aug 2011, 11:13 pm

powerw00t wrote:Cadang tukar tajuk atau buat penambahan sikit supaya tak derailed sangat dari... mochi?

anya derail ye power?....

by mumuchi Fri 05 Aug 2011, 11:29 pm

nolah..just creative ways to discuss what communnism is..melike... Cool

by anya8797 Sat 06 Aug 2011, 10:12 pm

yeyy... anya tak derail.... cheers

by anya8797 Sat 06 Aug 2011, 10:20 pm

MMW wrote:

But what you said is true.... Communist theory cantik but impractical. Tengok Hermit Kingdom - North Korea aje le. Kim Jong Il lives lavishly but the people starved!!!

What you said " there are those who are more 'equal' than the others.... and when this happens in a nation that is highly regimented with blind obedience.... the result is even more devastating...." can be seen in North Korea.

the people are starving yet they practically worship the ground kim jong il threads upon.... see how george orwell illustrates this through the character squealer.....how propaganda works at its best in order to justify this absurdity.....

"Animal Farm" successfully presents how the mechanism of propaganda and brainwashing works in totalitarian regimes, by showing how the pigs could make the other animals believe practically anything. Responsible for the propaganda was Squealer, a pig that "could turn black into white". Squealer managed to change the rule from "all animals are equal" to" all animals are equal but some animals are more equal than others". He managed to convince the other animals that it was for their sake that the pigs ate most of the apples and drank most of the milk, that leadership was "heavy responsibility" and therefore the animals should be thankful to Napoleon, that what they saw may have been something they "dreamed", and when everything else failed he would use the threat of " Jones returning" to silence the animals. In this simple but effective way, Orwell presents the tragedy and confusion of thought control to the extent that one seems better off simply believing that" Napoleon is always right".

this is what happening in north korea.....

by standupper Thu 21 Jun 2012, 1:39 pm

Tapak tanah rizab untuk rekod dan kisah Pemberontakan bersenjata PKM. Thread sebelum nie ntah sapa dah jual.

Memetik tulisan Zam dalam blognya zamkata.blogspot.com

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CHIN PENG DALAM KEADAAN TENAT DI BANGKOK

Seorang pemimpin perang gurila di hutan rimba Malaysia dan Thailand yang gagal mencapai matlamatnya setelah berjuang lebih 40 tahun yang mengorbankan antara empat hingga lima ribu anggotanya, sekarang sedang menghadapi saat-saat kematian di Thailand.

Bekas Setiausaha Agung Parti Komunis Malaya, Chin Peng 90 tahun sedang dirawat disebuah hospital swasta di Bangkok dan berita-berita terakhir yang diterima di sini mengatakan keadaannya semakin tenat.

Dalam buku memoir peninggalannya bertajuk "My Side Of Story", Chin Peng berkata, bukunya itu bukanlah bertujuan untuk membanggakan atau meminta maaf, tetapi ini adalah jemputan untuk memahami bagaimana kepercayaan terbentuk dan bagaimana persengketaaan boleh bermula serta berjalan tanpa dapat diredakan.

Disamping itu, ia juga suatu pandangan bagaimana perdamaian dapat dicapai, katanya.

Rakan seperjuangannya Rashid Maidin yang memimpin Regimen ke 10, telahpun meninggal dunia pada 31 Ogos 2006, kerana sakit tua dalam usia 89 tahun di Sisakoin, Narathiwat, Selatan Thailand (dirumah anak perempuannya).

Beberapa orang kenalan rapat dari Malaysia dan Singapura yang melawatnya baru-baru ini, mendapati keadaannya sangat uzur dan tidak lagi dapat mengenali penziarahnya.

Seorang dari dua pembantu yang berada di sisinya memberitahu mereka, bahawa Chin Peng telah dikejarkan ke hospial dari rumahnya di luar kota Bangkok setelah keadaan kesihatannya semakin meruncing.

Dua pembantunya cuba untuk memberitahu kedatangan pelawat, tetapi dia kelihatan seperti antara sedar dan tidak sedar. Mereka diberitahu oleh salah seorang pembantunya, bahawa sebelum ini dia telah bercakap mengenai kematiannya.

Chin Peng dilahirkan di tingkat atas rumah kedai dua tingkat di Kampong Koh, Sitiawan Perak, telah menjadi anggota Parti Komunis Malaya (PKM) sejak berusia 15 tahun. Dia dilantik menjadi Setiausaha Agung PKM pada 1947 setelah Setiausaha Agung pertamanya, Lai Te menghilangkan diri dengan membawa mas dan wang $ 1 juta.(dollar).

Sumber-sumber keselamatan pernah memberithau saya, bahawa Chin Peng mempunyai wang tunai yang berbaki kepadanya dari Comintern (Komunis Antarabangsa) sebanyak RM5 juta setelah tamatnya perjuangan PKM.

Beliau memimpin perang gurila di hutan Malaya dan Thailand sejak sebelum peristiharan darurat 1948 untuk menentang penjajah British, setelah British gagal untuk menyerahkan Malaya kepada PKM.

Ketua Menteri Kerajaan Sendiri Persekutuan yang dipimpin oleh Tunku Abdul Rahman, telah bersetuju mengadakan rundingan mencari perdamaian dengan Chin Peng dan rakan-rakannya, tetapi rundingan itu yang diadakan di Baling pada 28 dan 29 Disember 1955 telah gagal, kerana PKM menolak tawaran kerajaan supaya menyerah diri dan Parti Komunis Malaya diharamkan.

PKM memilih untuk terus berjuang dalam hutan, tetapi kelumpuhan komunisme antarabangsa yang melibatkan negara-negara komunis; Republic Rakyat Cina, Soviet Union dan Eropah Timur pada petengahan tahun 1980, telah melemahkan moral PKM dan mereka mencari jalan untuk menamatkan perjuangan secara bermaruah.

Sebenarnya pada masa itu Pasukan Keselamatan Malaysia telah mampu untuk menghapuskan mereka, tetapi Perdana Menteri Tun Dr. Mahhtir Mohamad memikirkan dari segi kemanusiaan dan tidak mahu membazirkan wang negara untuk memburu mereka dan kerana itu bersetuju rundingan damai diadakan atas permintaan PKM sendiri.

Rundingan damai itu yang berjalan secara sulit selama lebih setahun, berakhir dengan penandatangan perjanjian damai antara tiga pihak; iaitu kerajaan Malaysia, Kerajaan Diraja Thailand dan PKM di Haadyai pada 2 Disember 1989.

Menurut buku memoirnya Chin Peng "My Side of Story", perjuangannya selama lebih 40 tahun itu telah mengorbankan antara empat hingga lima ribu anggota gurilanya dan 200 orang telah digantung, diantara mereka adalah wanita.

Katanya, dia berjuang dalam dua peperangan (menentang Jepun, menentang British dan Kerajaan Malaysia) dan bertahun tahun hutan menjadi kediamannya.

Perundingan damai yang terakhir itu berlaku panjang dibelakang tabir selama lebih setahun antara tiga pihak dengan Polis Cawangan Khas yang diketuai oleh Ketua Pengarah Polis Cawangan Khas, Tan Sri Abdul Rahim Noor.

by mumuchi Tue 26 Jun 2012, 9:34 am

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Malay Regiment scaout car during the Insurgencies at Malaya

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RMAF CARIBOU during the time of Insurgencies

Semua Kredit Mr Kurien

by dewafrost Tue 26 Jun 2012, 10:42 am

dart herald kita ada pengalaman dlm proses pengeluaran warga kita dari konflik perang vietnam woooo....

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